Where is the realm going?

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Where is the realm going?

Post by Reyxor - Lucag on Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:30 pm

I'm wondering. Trying to see positive side of it, but it's not too easy. Seems mostly pockets or rp:ers doing their own things, the public events are there, but seems to be few taking part in general to what there is, at least some happening.

I'm just bored today, so thought to send the word out for anyone who might want to tell their point of view.

Put me out of my misery, lol. Or do something!
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Cid on Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:18 am

First issue, you are right that there are rather few roleplayers partaking in events. This is mainly because there isn't really that many roleplayers on this server as there used to be. Which brings me to the second issue.

We lack opponents. Horde roleplayers are a must to have if we are to live up to the RP-PvP tag that attracts people. We have been declining ever since the Horde RP guilds were driven off over some silly, toxic disagreements and 'bounty' hunts. Alliance roleplayers (COGSHIELD) actively hunted down those they disagreed with to attack them on their events, which didn't bring any good whatsoever. Which brings me to the third issue.

This server and the community on it don't really do anything active in terms of advertisement, relying on reputation to be spread 'automatically', which we clearly see is not working (either that, or it may be that our reputation isn't enviable. Either way, it is not a good position to be in). We need to work on the toxicity levels if we are to get a proper reputation and get more people here to work with us, if we are to survive as a RP-realm.

Fourth issue is part of third issue, as we lack someone who can make recruitment videos and such. When the community was larger, we had people like Melvenor, Kozgugore (I think it was he who made the ORB video at least), Spyre etc, who all made videos and machinima promoting lore, our server and guilds etc. These days we lack updated material to post on forums and youtube, which further feeds those who claim that RP is dead on this server.

It doesn't help anything whatsoever that we hide away from the realm forums and other public channels. We miss out great opportunities of recruitment by not using those to promote our activities. Sure enough, we might get trolls along once in a while, but we need to show others that we are doing something actively, that we are not a dead realm RP-wise as so many claim.

Those are my few coppers on the matter. Others might not agree with me about this, but remember that I first and foremost have held the servers best interest in mind. We need progressive discussions and actions, not naysayers who say 'no' just because any thought of change is horrifying to them.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Reyxor - Lucag on Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:36 am

Good points, I find it hilarious these days, as soon as there has been new rp:ers and they'd wish to learn to rp, the direction it goes is often Argent Dawn. As it's mostly populated with rp:ers I think it's quite plausible, but find it demoralizing myself to try to recruit these days. Since it starts to move to AD very quickly, once it's seen how big difference there is in amount of rp:ers.

The thing is, AD is big in numbers, but there individuals easily sunk into there I guess and it's like there is a lot of drama, and annoying rp. Looking at Discord on AD and DB, that I happen to know at least, are like hurricane and calm when compared to weather conditions.

My venture cross realm has proved it's a lot different, there are good rp guilds on AD don't get me wrong, I respect some of the players or like most, but there isn't at this stage I'm learning of it not better, else than if you wish to see a lot of rp:ers.

I however would like to see more rp:ers on DB et al. I don't mean to try to somehow divert players from AD to DB, but simply as Cid there well said, promote a bit DB too, not on AD but DB realm forums, I agree.

Anyway, there is some stronger community feeling on DB, as players don't have a lot of players to get to know with, so players are playing with same players more. Since there is no Horde on DB currently, this is quite astonishing situation in my opinion to do something new for any Horde rp guilds there may be, since there is no one telling what to do or not to do.

As for Alliance I'm content but as Cid told the rp-pvp is currently non existant. I tried to start something at Howling Fjord, yet I guess neither Alliance on AD or DB were too intersted in cross realm, however some Horde players were quite alright with the idea of cross realm rp-pvp. I request some understanding, if there is any interest at all in rp-pvp to bear with doing it cross realm, I enjoyed it as much as any before rp-pvp on DB.

Cross realm is at first unsuitable for me too, but due to the circumstances it has become for me a must, and accepting events cross realm would be for the better of AD and DB, since both have a lot to gain from each server community. There is a barrier in between cross realm rp, but it's just there to be broken.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Naroma on Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:06 am

The people who want to RP amongst themselves have no need to promote externally, the people who want more active random RP are generally (in my opinion) always seeking someone else to bring it in for them, and/or struggle to find other players who share their enthusiasm to put time into promoting the server.

There's no quick 'fix' to what some of you feel is broken. Very few people are actively seeking the boom in activity a minority are vocal about bringing about.

The majority seems to be the small groups content with their RP. Which is okay, and pretty much what the server offers for smaller scale RP. Don't really see it changing, or see it as a bad thing.

And regarding your point about hiding away from realm forums etc, speaking for myself, I'm not hiding from them, but neither do I have a reason to actively seek them. We all know what exists on DB.. And to be honest, so does everyone from other realms. Small pockets of focused RP. Its not that we aren't visible and people are going to be surprised we have things going on. Activities decline with the age of a game, usually player driven activities such as roleplaying are the first to feel the punch.

TL;DR Everyone knows about DB, but only a minority have the drive and desire to 'fix' it. Plenty of content players around.

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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Webbles on Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:32 am

If people don't attend Event X, there's a good chance that Event X is bad.

As for the realm forums, what they need is a bunch of dumb vaguely RP related threads like they have over on AD, because they showcase the presence of an RP community to anyone visiting the forums and make the server look fun and welcoming. No one gives a damn about the monthly bland guild recruitment bumps and event/campaign ads.

But this same discussion has already happened 129058 times. If you're not content with things, start actively changing them instead of whining about it.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Reyxor - Lucag on Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:58 am

Webbles wrote:If people don't attend Event X, there's a good chance that Event X is bad.

As for the realm forums, what they need is a bunch of dumb vaguely RP related threads like they have over on AD, because they showcase the presence of an RP community to anyone visiting the forums and make the server look fun and welcoming. No one gives a damn about the monthly bland guild recruitment bumps and event/campaign ads.

But this same discussion has already happened 129058 times. If you're not content with things, start actively changing them instead of whining about it.

Luvly, got it.

Instead of discrediting, be a hero for me and do at least try not to show you hate me as much as I think you do.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Webbles on Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:31 am

Reyxor - Lucag wrote:as much as I think you do.

I have no feelings towards you whatsoever. :)
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Azapha on Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:04 am

The reality is AD is a more practical realm to casual role play on. Theres a lot of RPers and activity and if that's what someone wants then it's there, DB sells to a smaller audience.

Webbles nailed it on one thing which is people Don't often pull big events or get numbers because there event probably sucked at selling or was expected to. If people really want to help get events going then support the people who try make them, we have some great event writers on DB just look at flemk's event posts.

It is what it is and complaining don't work as much as actually trying to do it.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Charlie Blazesong on Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:12 am

Cid, you're full of tosh. The Red Blades(Krogon) started something they couldn't finish. The whole bounty thing did little to nothing, other than when Krogon started one it turned into all out war though never camping. Something he in fact encouraged which was against the red blade rules. Now, one might say Krogon actively broke the rules. In all honesty, Cogshield would stop if he got kicked as he was the catalyst of it all, yet it didnt happen until after they moved to AD.

tl;dr don't talk shit if you're not prepared to face the consequences.



As for fixing this, it's going to be a lot of work to actually bring people back here. You see it every now and then, people come here and ask how rp is, if everyone who popped by came by and stayed we'd maybe have an additional 15 people per year come in from that alone. The thing is though, one player moving might cause more to move, we need to find the right fed up people to decide moving over is a right thing. We also need some oposition on Horde which will be hard to gather up.

Simply because from what I've seen the rp community Hordeside is even worse off than Alliance is currently. The problem is also the fact that a lot of people have started unsubbing which means there will be rp-curious people who arent around because they cba subbing to a game where all they have to do is raid ToS on farm.

There is also a convenience thing in the picture, as Azapha said earlier. AD is far more convenient if you have some downtime and want to rp. I do this myself from time to another, just log over to AD for some rp whereas on DB I'd probably have to wait for an event and when the event is there I may not feel like rping at all. There is always the argument of pinging lfrp if you're up for rp but more often than not it'll either lead to a less than satisfying gathering or none at all. Heck they might even be people your character don't particularly like at all. Which won't amount to much conversation because if I don't like someone IRL I most definitely wont want to talk to them, which will most likely be the case in my characters assessment of the situation.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Nare on Mon Nov 06, 2017 5:33 pm

Where is the realm going? Well, DB was the most active RP-PVP realm there was and still is. In next expansion being on pve or pvp realm does not matter, so we are reduced down into a another rp realm with low population and non-existent random rp compared to AD. In short we will lose our main difference when compared to AD, the RP-PVP realm status.

As you all know, most of the rp happens in guilds at DB. However I belive that most of the new rp:ers start with random rp, they grab their toon and hit the closest crowded tavern, because all the great adventures start from a tavern. Well DB does not have crowded tavern - at least not in the horde side. And am I right if I say that we cannot describe blue side inns to be crowded either? So most of our new roleplayers wont' have easy access for rp in DB and they end up in AD.

The classic recipe into fixing this is to make attractive and good rp communities, guilds in our case. They need a good concept, active players, which turns into some sort of hub hopefully and attracts more ppl that way. Getting the first ppl is the hardest part, then you need to have a proper amount of quality activity, if the activities are boring, ppl won't show up again. I bet most of you if not all knew this already tho Razz

So where is the realm going? Well it doesn't look well activity-wise, unless we get ppl who are willing to sink great amount of time and effort into building up the community. I'd guess some guilds will remain here and singular players wil slowly switch to AD.

As a wild card option there might be a chance that now that realm types don't matter regardign pve vs pvp... it might be that all rp realms will be merged to AD someway, that fixes the new player problem, yet it could ruin it for those who prefer smaller realm.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Skarain on Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:31 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

A topic about RP-PvP servers was just raised on Roleplaying forums.

(I'll write my own thoughts later)

-----------

Edit: ...a few moments later:

A Wall of Text:
As for my own thoughts...

As a player who fought teeth and claw for the server for roughly five years, I have exhaust most of my optimism that things would turn out better again. The changes that the expansion brings into the PvP system would be a GOOD thing for Defias Brotherhood.

Problem is, it came 5 years to late.

A brief lesson in History of the Server: The way I understand, in the beginning there were only RP, PvP and PvE servers. At a point, Blizzard decided to launch some RP-PvP servers. People on the RP servers who loved the idea of PvP decided to hop into the RP-PvP server which name came first in the alphabetical order. That server turned out to be Defias Brotherhood.

Back in those days, the popularity of the game was sky-high. World of Warcraft was known as -the- MMORPG, and still holds a fragment of it's reputation. However time goes and the world changes. There are many other MMORPG's that compete with WoW in the amount of people.

As the game progresses, the lore gets more fleshed out. While we love new Lore, it means that there are less "empty holes" that Players can build upon. When the game offers you most of the solutions by telling the story of the land, there are less "creativity" players can make use in inventing their own stuff without violating Canon. I believe this "might" have affected the activity, but not as much as the point below.

I do not believe that Defias Brotherhood would have had any kind of decline, if not for the Non-Roleplaying PvPers who choose to grief Roleplayers. Back in Cataclysm, the amount of Roleplayers was still high, even if I was told that Wrath was the real golden era. However the Griefers of those times did impact the Community by driving people leaving, and the state of the game & other factors have kept that wheel turning.

The way Roleplaying works in games as these is that it "fuels upon itself". Roleplayers are extraordinary in the way that they do not "require" content the same way as other Players do. Roleplayers are able to generate their own content and their own adventures.

However, what Roleplayers need is other Roleplayers. Our content is dependent on -us- Roleplayers being able to turn our own wheel, and the more people we have turning the wheel, the larger the wheel and the faster it can spin. When the wheel got enough momentum (visibility), it grabs on strays along it path and takes them along (new roleplayers), and the wheel keeps on turning.

The PvP "griefing", while abiding the rules placed by Blizzard, it still ruined a lot of RP. If you would have been able to turn your PvP off/on, depending on your feel, and still get enough PvP when you feel like when it's turned on, I think the RP-PvP guilds would have thrived and those who do not want to fight OOCers could have just stayed away from them. The times we had to "pretend" an area was something else, to be able to RP, when we retreated back to Faction Areas just to be able to continue our RP in peace were many, and eventually some people just had enough and left to a server where PvP was optional.

----

My conclusion is:

Blizzard are planning to make changes that are going to "Make World-PvP Great Again". Blizzard will never do the same for Roleplayers. There will never come a "RP tag" function. Blizzard however gave us the tools of "Grief-free RP" and "As much World PvP as we want", or none if you rather have it that way.

Defias Brotherhood won't improve at on itself.

I would however like to present a theoretical question:

"If Blizzard were to announce an entirely new RP server, an "Empty" server, how many roleplayers do you think would take the chance to create a NEW Roleplaying Community and start on a "blank slate"?"

I can bet my pants that pretty many would.

---

So, the second question is:

"Can you/we/us Roleplayers create the Wheel we need out from nothing and start the cycle ourselves?"

Yes. We CAN.

The third question is:

"Is there any reason a "Second" Roleplaying server should exist besides the "First"? (Argent Dawn)"

If we can find enough reasons to say "Yes" to the Third Question, then we Roleplayers CAN 'create' the "Second Wheel".

EDIT: The question got me curious, so I made a Battle.net Forum post on Roleplaying forums, asking for that question.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I would like to present all Roleplayers three very interesting theoretical questions:
1.) "If Blizzard were to announce an entirely new RP server, an "Empty" server, how many roleplayers do you think would take the chance to create a NEW Roleplaying Community there and start on a "blank slate"?"
2.) What would be your "ideal" roleplaying server be like? If you got to choose exactly how it is organized and how the community within would be? (Within the bounds and limitations that World of Warcraft currently/Next X-pack allows).
3.) "Is there any reason a "Second" Roleplaying server should exist besides the large and massive "First"? (Argent Dawn)". If so, why?
Please also respond on the Roleplaying forums post, if you'd like your discussion and argument to reach more ears and eyes than those that browse these forums.

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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Praeceps on Wed Nov 08, 2017 10:50 am

Skarain wrote:
"If Blizzard were to announce an entirely new RP server, an "Empty" server, how many roleplayers do you think would take the chance to create a NEW Roleplaying Community and start on a "blank slate"?"

I can bet my pants that pretty many would.

---

I'm not holding you to that bet as I'm also sure quite a few people from the DB and AD realms will move over. However I think it won't be long before it's turned into another carbon copy of either DB or AD, depending on which community is the largest. The people moving over will each have their own ideas on what worked best on their server and will try to implement it onto the new server.

Merging all the RP-realms as the topicstarter in the bnetforum post would like to see is imo also a terrible idea. Let's not forget both AD and DB have a huge backlog of history and storylines behind them, expecting one community to drop and ignore all of that and continue afresh is not really a possibility.

I don't want to be the big pessimisit here, but we should be realisitc. RP doesn't seem to be a high priority for Blizzard, in regards to the PvP and PvE communities we are by far the smallest community of them all.
That being said, I'm sure there are ways we would atleast rekindle the interest in RP a bit without drastic changes like new servers or server mergings.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

Post by Ixirar/Kavalis on Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:31 am

Nare wrote:Where is the realm going? Well, DB was the most active RP-PVP realm there was and still is.

To be fair it's the only RP-PVP realm there is now, since all the other ones are linked to this one.
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Re: Where is the realm going?

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