[A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Allonia_Miral on Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:00 am

Samian/Bismack wrote:
My character is wanted on multiple charges and yet I can go to Stormwind and walk around a bar, with a hat on and act as if nothing has happened.

And thats poor on who's behalf? This is the foundation of RP on DB atm, circle rp with nothing really going on.

I must admit I found it a bit odd when a highly wanted criminal could address the council and just walk away, with the room full of guards and "lawful" guilds.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Izzifix on Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:33 am

Speaking as a low ranking guard guild member:
IC communication about ongoing cases is near non-existant. My character for example, does not really have -any- clue why we keep arresting Garret, or who that Mantis Reid is. I believe we have some potential to improve at that.

A lot of guardsman energy and time is currently used for drunken brawler/rampaging death knight (who 90% of the time smiles, isn't that pretty cool guiz? A murderous death knight that smiles! Creativity knows no limits!) of the week-damage control (read: detain and take a million stabs, punches and insults) or breaking up yet another fight between Bunch of the Bold draenei and their many, many enemies. As such, the more comitted criminals have a lot of competition for guardsman patience (when it's the 5th murder in an evening, IC tempers run hot) and time.

As such, the criminals we as guards probably would like to be chasing, building elaborate cases against for arrest and trials etc, tend not to get the attention and time they should.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Garrett on Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:17 am

Dwyburn wrote:IC communication about ongoing cases is near non-existant.

Yeah, I can confirm this, during my time as a guard, the "wanted list" was a complete joke, it's non-existent and just something you tell IC'ly to people who might run away if they should try to escape, things might've changed, at least I sincerely hope so, but that's how things were when I happened to be RP'ing as a guard.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Samian/Bismack on Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:39 am

So the guards should do IRL homework and keep track of every individual who ever committed a crime? While all you crooks get to run around and be totally badass? Whisper a guard on how wanted you are when you're standing there in public or post here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

DB is a utopia for criminals, no radios, only semi-intelligent non godly guards and yet still you whine about shit like /yell's

People dont roleplay guards to make your character look more badass, they are there to rp for their own fun. Not yours. edit: EVERYONE should rp for fun, just because people rp authority does not mean it has to feel like a job IRL.

ps. 20 euros an hour and I RP anything you would've ever wanted.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Reynar / Raviran on Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:19 am

Samian/Bismack wrote:So the guards should do IRL homework and keep track of every individual who ever committed a crime? While all you crooks get to run around and be totally badass? Whisper a guard on how wanted you are when you're standing there in public or post here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

DB is a utopia for criminals, no radios, only semi-intelligent non godly guards and yet still you whine about shit like /yell's

People dont roleplay guards to make your character look more badass, they are there to rp for their own fun. Not yours. edit: EVERYONE should rp for fun, just because people rp authority does not mean it has to feel like a job IRL.

ps. 20 euros an hour and I RP anything you would've ever wanted.

Man..."Utopia" existed some years ago maybe, but today? Nawh.

We all know why there are no radios (I hope I'm not the only one who remembers how bullshit those walkie-talkies were.) and on the topic of "IRL work", both criminals and guards should work on making the file on the prisoner fun and interactive. Not a chore.

I'd say the Criminal would be a lot happier to RP out a few interrogations about the arrest (While the guard writes it down on a GHI note maybe? Not a big deal.) rather then AFK in the cells. Same goes to the Guard aswell, we're not talking about a freaking novel here Quin jesus. A few spots to fill in maybe? Name: X / Age: X / Race: X / Height: X / Notable looks: X / Reason for Arrest: X        Boom! There you go, done.

You can easily RP those out and fill them in both ICly and OOCly, it's really not that hard Quin!

PS. Making those GHI files and providing them to a bookie(s) who then can actually RP out inspecting said files etc. (I've seen many people who enjoy the GHI paperwork and RP as secretaries / bookies / other officials who work with a quill and a paper.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Samian/Bismack on Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:24 pm

[quote="Reynar / Raviran"]
Samian/Bismack wrote:So the guards should do IRL homework and keep track of every individual who ever committed a crime? While all you crooks get to run around and be totally badass? Whisper a guard on how wanted you are when you're standing there in public or post here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

DB is a utopia for criminals, no radios, only semi-intelligent non godly guards and yet still you whine about shit like /yell's

People dont roleplay guards to make your character look more badass, they are there to rp for their own fun. Not yours. edit: EVERYONE should rp for fun, just because people rp authority does not mean it has to feel like a job IRL.

ps. 20 euros an hour and I RP anything you would've ever wanted.

You can easily RP those out and fill them in both ICly and OOCly, it's really not that hard Quin!

PS. Making those GHI files and providing them to a bookie(s) who then can actually RP out inspecting said files etc. (I've seen many people who enjoy the GHI paperwork and RP as secretaries / bookies / other officials who work with a quill and a paper.

Please stop being delusional, I hereby invite anyone from the cartel to come fulfill the roll of guard secretary and keep track of all the records. Hf.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Reynar / Raviran on Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:03 pm

Dude, it was just a suggestion. You and I both have met people who have done that in the past.
If you want to be an ass about it then fine, vent ahead.

Just saying that there's plenty of ways to show your IC and OOC dedication to a guard guild other then just "Catch & Grab, Lock & Release".

"We all want to have fun." Well of course! The whole point of this fucking thread.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Kayle Ravelle on Tue Aug 26, 2014 12:48 am

Please stop being delusional, I hereby invite anyone from the cartel to come fulfill the roll of guard secretary and keep track of all the records. Hf.

They might at least attempt to react to situations like actual guards would. I mean, unless every victim has swallowed a megaphone, their yells wouldn't reach far in a crowded city such as our glorious capital.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Ralegh on Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:39 am

Syker wrote:
They might at least attempt to react to situations like actual guards would. I mean, unless every victim has swallowed a megaphone, their yells wouldn't reach far in a crowded city such as our glorious capital.
I generally can't be arsed to stop to whisper everybody that yells to ask where they are, to then judge if i could hear them or not.

If its in /y range I will react to it as if my character can hear it, anything else ends up being to much hassle for a close to non-existant gain.

As for some of the other things discussed:
Unless the player actually has a love for paperwork and wants to create reports I honestly don't see what it would improve.
Most of these things can be sorted out in a whisper.
The same generally goes for prison time, if you sit in a prison and feel forgotten it might just be because you are.
Poke the people keeping you and ask for some rp or potentially to be released if you have been there for a while.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Izzifix on Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:20 am

As for the yelling-issues:

Asking in a whisper if yells for help can be held in /s due to the incredible range of ingame yells, to try to keep the situation in a non-clusterfuck state, might help if one is abusing the rights of a reasonable player's citizen... Just a thought, ofc. Having the message macro-ed for quick use when a situation arises might be a good trick for criminals who wish to keep things believable.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by CrusaderElly on Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:24 pm

Current neutral guilds: (In SW)
The Slaughted Lamb

Wrong, they are lawful good guards!
Spoiler:
*snickers* No they're not!

They may have changed this, but while I was in the Cartel, the council-approved list of city laws didn't state that drugs were illegal, and upon inquiry the answer was that there was no law that would prohibit consumption of those substances.

Aye, OOC and IC both, people requested for certain drugs to be banned by law, OOC because it would be more fun that way, IC because the drugs proved to be very dangerous and offer little to no beneficial effect on consumption. They have since been added to the SW law, and if at any time people want to add or remove drugs from the list, an appeal to the council or a letter to the right person will fix that quickly!

I'd also advocate there being no other jail time punishment than "Overnight" unless the situation specifically calls for it (as in, if the criminal specifically does something that would require him being locked up while his case is handled), and any time you feel the need to lock somebody up for more than a day, figure out a different punishment instead.

Usually the law offers options whether you wish to take jailtime or not, and when you do, usually it's only for a night. It doesn't make a lot of sense in a real world, but criminal rp does need to be possible.. Of course, there will always be guards that say 'sod the law' and do their own thing, which is kinda fun I think, and if you want an extended period of time on purpose for ooc enjoyment or whatever, with some originality it's definitely possible! Either way, whispers, whispers.

yelling "LOCATION?!"

Fun fact: various spots in mage district, if not all, are fully out of /y range of the usual rp hubs, most noticeably the guard ones! We found this out the hard way. Very Happy

Otherwise, if I do decide to perform a /y regarding kidnappings or w/e (preferably just /say [loud]), I tend to include a rough description of the general area (/yell [mage district?] blahblah).

I've seen many people who enjoy the GHI paperwork and RP as secretaries / bookies

Love rp'ing it and I do keep some track of IC things, but yeah keeping track of every criminal is a bit of a hassle. ^^ It would be cool, it would be realistic, but..

I'm not sure who these are, but just to make it clear: Who decides whether or not they're a guard guild?

Currently if people want guard rights they usually apply to the council for them, after which a vote is issued (a vote that involves representatives from a variety of rp guilds on Defias). Of course, we can't force people to follow the council's decision, so there might be self-proclaimed guards out there.


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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Charlie Blazesong on Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:17 am

To be fair, most of this happen at night with worgen stationed as guards. A yell could perhaps carry it's weight to a guards ears without much more then that as an explanation. There isnt much chit chatter in the streets to deafen it, only corners for it through echo through and even cause confusion. If thugs were actually smart enough to stop them from opening their mouths, now that would be something.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by siegmund on Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:54 am

If thugs were actually smart enough to stop them from opening their mouths, now that would be something.

/Y Kindap and tie them up!

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Reynar / Raviran on Wed Aug 27, 2014 9:12 am

Charlie Blazesong wrote:If thugs were actually smart enough to stop them from opening their mouths, now that would be something.

That is literally a race on us writing the emote faster than the victim doing /y Help!

People should really wait for the emotes instead of just straight speed-raping the keyboard for the yell.

EDIT: Or emoting that he's about to yell, now that would be cool. Doing a /roll if he gets the chance to yell.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Marijn on Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:16 pm

I wish to add my opinion to the whole issue, as someone who has been playing a guard character I know fully well how stressfull certain nights can be, alot happening IC forces people to neglect some of their tasks, for instance people set in jail. I agree fully that jail is boring, I already try to sentence most things within the day, one night in the cells and the punishment on the day afterwards (since most crimes happen at night). As for the RP inside the cells, when multiple prisoners are down there together, RP together and just have some fun. Of course, if you're alone we guards do try our best to keep it interesting, but as stated by someone else, it's often a challenge to mix that and the people that require our attention.

From a criminal stand point, I agree that escaping is one a the better things, getting away from a crime sometimes unharmed or with some struggle makes is worthwhile. Though if you're wanted, it's often a case of people chasing you for some time, before starting to walk past you without doing a thing. This can often be because they're dealing with someone else, or in fact don't know about the situation. The wanted posters should be something that's passed down on others so people will notice.

Another thing i'd like to add about them not chasing you in character, I have to add, it's hard. Trying to find someone without meta gaming without any evidence or trail and just searching every nook and cranny in Stormwind is something no one feels like doing on a daily basis. Sure patrols are there exacly for that reason, and we've extended not all patrols to search every where in the city, because even though it's our 'job' is boring as fuck walking around without finding anything, hoping to walk into someone. We did add a rule to patrol once every fifth patrol you do to make it an entire city scout, and a full city run takes up to 2 hours, if you want to cover every inch of the city, wich is quite the pain.

So basicly, searching for wanted criminals without any trail is kind of useless unless you plan to make two hours patrols every now and then. So for wanted people, try to whisper guards and leave trails if you want the RP.

That's my opinion about the matter, and I know how annoying guard - criminal RP can be at times, long wait times, or other issues. We try our best to keep it a fun experience for all of us. We ourselves also love some spotlight for our character, and not just be punching bags, as I know so do you.

To wrap this up, I do hope everyone of you will keep doing to their bests to promote guard and criminal RP, because without the other both RP sides are quite boring in general.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Bradley on Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:29 pm

CrusaderElly wrote:
I'm not sure who these are, but just to make it clear: Who decides whether or not they're a guard guild?

Currently if people want guard rights they usually apply to the council for them, after which a vote is issued (a vote that involves representatives from a variety of rp guilds on Defias). Of course, we can't force people to follow the council's decision, so there might be self-proclaimed guards out there.

The guild themselves decide whether or not they're a guard guild. Not the council or anyone else for that matter.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Ledgic on Thu Aug 28, 2014 3:09 am

^

Even the old council threw out the idea of guard rights having to be applied for.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Rae Wulfgnar on Thu Aug 28, 2014 2:37 pm

The reason why guard rights are applied for, is to prevent there being too many guard guilds...you take that away and any-one can be a guard, which is a bit dull if their is no restrictions.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Bradley on Thu Aug 28, 2014 3:12 pm

There's too many guilds with guard rights these days. And yet I stand by the fact that nobody can 'restrict' someone else from making the guild that they want to make. If people wanna have guard-rights, let them have guard-rights. It's certainly not up to the council or anyone else on DB who's not a part of the respective guild anyway.

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Ledgic on Thu Aug 28, 2014 11:10 pm

Rae Wulfgnar wrote:The reason why guard rights are applied for, is to prevent there being too many guard guilds...you take that away and any-one can be a guard, which is a bit dull if their is no restrictions.

That's the reason it existed before, yeah. A couple of others and myself had it chucked out though. It's restricting one area of RP and forcing anyone in that RP genre to RP with the council, which isn't fair.

This is however a little off-topic >>

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

Post by Izzifix on Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:30 am

I think I know a certain conflict that may have been important background for that change Razz

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Re: [A] Crooks & Saints (Discussion thread)

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