[Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Lexgrad on Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:57 am

((You only say that Khen as secretly you still one day want to be king of Lordaeron XD))

Jarric spreads sand over his writings, letting the ink dry out.

"These upstart half men will learn their place in this alliance what!  A bounty on a guard of stormwind... What is going through their drunken, pompous, puffed up minds!   King Varian will remove their beards and tip their ale all over their ardor! Why this is as pathectic as when they decided they did not to recognize Stormwind and yet send that poor ambassador to every meeting"

Jarric chuckles and calls out for his Buttler. 

"Jenkins, what do you think of this letter?"

Jenkins begins to read it out...."To the honourable Council of Stormwind...."

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Littlepip on Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:58 am

(( Personally I think this is a great idea and sounds interesting. That's all I have to say xD ))

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Thelos on Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:05 pm

Spoiler:
Lexgrad wrote:((You cant really make it an IC discussion if you reject the premiss that RPers can run states.))
This, really. Forcing people to discuss a topic on terms that force them to actually accept the premise that is being argued against makes them hypocritical, like Zigger wanted to make erwtenpeller out to be. It's a very cheap way to turn an argument to your favor - one that has been under scrutiny before. I don't see the merits in moving the discussion on this topic elsewhere, sans marginalizing it and reinforcing the legitimacy of something I dissaprove of by isolating the critique.

I for one refuse to accept that which has been posted here is the official stance of the Dwarves on their forgeign policy, especially when there's been a movement in reverse in the actual lore, with Moira backing Varian and convincing the other two council members to do the same.

But I guess you guys can go ahead and play with this if you want, as long as it doesn't put me in the position when I am ICly forced to acknowledge the premise I here rejected. I don't think the entire community has to be in agreement on everything and it's perfectly fine to play in different realities simaltenously. You can keep on playing that you represent Ironforge government and I will stick to only accepting the authority of the NPCs. Live and let live; tolerate one another. As long as you don't have to actually interact on basis of premisses you disapprove of, you don't really have a reason to complain. It's none of my business what other people I don't interact with are playing.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Darilas on Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:19 pm

Fix!?:
((Let some rich Dwarf lord with the delusion he is of great influence be the writer of the pamphlet instead of a council with at best debated authority. Problem solved and more RP possibilities for the community to deal with the reward, captives and possibly the Dawrf lord.))

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Thelos on Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:38 pm

Spoiler:
Nah. I'd rather just let people role-play as they want and adapt on my end, instead of demanding others to adapt to better match my own play. I can just write it off as some kind of weird rumor, or like some crazy nobleman's delusional efforts, like you just suggested. It's all good - people like me will find a manage to tolerate and cope, like we always do ^^

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Drustai on Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:40 pm

Thelos wrote:I for one refuse to accept that which has been posted here is the official stance of the Dwarves on their forgeign policy, especially when there's been a movement in reverse in the actual lore, with Moira backing Varian and convincing the other two council members to do the same.
Except that it's posted by the Dept of Justice, and therefore does not represent the official foreign policy of the dwarves.

Also, keep in mind that the bounties are against Rargnasha and the Red Blades specifically, and not the Darkspear Rebellion in general. This is a key thing that people are missing. This is a player bounty on a player commander and a player organization. The fact that the targeted players in question are members of the Darkspear Rebellion does not change the fact that the bounties are targeted on those specific groups and NOT the whole Rebellion. Being part of the Rebellion does not on its own mean that those groups are suddenly immune to any and all prosecution. It can be considered bad form, but it is not strictly wrong as Rargnasha/Red Blades have committed what would be considered criminal action against Ironforge in the past and IF may wish to hold them accountable despite current alliances.

Consider Poland's accusations and requests for action against the Soviet Union during World War II, due to the actions the Soviets had made against Poland earlier in the war. In this example, the Senate is somewhat playing the part of Poland, and Stormwind (or rather, Areyah in particular, as she is MoD and therefore doesn't represent official Stormwind foreign policy) playing the part of the western allies in attempting to white wash the previous actions in order to maintain current relations.


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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Thelos on Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:45 pm

Spoiler:
Like I said, Drustai: have fun playing it out!

It's just obviously not my cup of tea. Nor that of some others who voiced their complaints here. I'll tolerate it, but won't partake in propagating such role-play. Approval is not the same as toleration; in fact, it's sort of implied that you need to disapprove of something before you can tolerate it. I dissaprove of this because of the aforementioned reasons, but I don't see the sense in actively boycotting it either.

I guess that's all you'll hear from me.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Lexgrad on Sun Sep 29, 2013 5:45 pm

((idk, at least the SW council try to keep inside and within the lore mostly. The Senate just smashes it all to do their rather stupid brand of lol commie RP. The senate does not even come close to dwarves in lore who are happy fellows and very sociable.

Most of what the Senate does is just either made up posts on this forum (Lexgrad raises a thousand dead and is now the lich prince)) Or it is just fighting with the SW council for ooc reasons, infact their whole existance is based on OOC discomfort of the council (We dont like this power play, lets make a less representative version of it cos lol).

To top it off they cant even make RP happen in their own city which if they could make it a hub, would excuse much of what they do or do not do for RP.

But lets keep this IC everyone.))

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Vardrek/Burgen on Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:44 pm

Thelos wrote:
Spoiler:

Lexgrad wrote:((You cant really make it an IC discussion if you reject the premiss that RPers can run states.))
This, really. Forcing people to discuss a topic on terms that force them to actually accept the premise that is being argued against makes them hypocritical, like Zigger wanted to make erwtenpeller out to be. It's a very cheap way to turn an argument to your favor - one that has been under scrutiny before. I don't see the merits in moving the discussion on this topic elsewhere, sans marginalizing it and reinforcing the legitimacy of something I dissaprove of by isolating the critique.

I for one refuse to accept that which has been posted here is the official stance of the Dwarves on their forgeign policy, especially when there's been a movement in reverse in the actual lore, with Moira backing Varian and convincing the other two council members to do the same.

But I guess you guys can go ahead and play with this if you want, as long as it doesn't put me in the position when I am ICly forced to acknowledge the premise I here rejected. I don't think the entire community has to be in agreement on everything and it's perfectly fine to play in different realities simaltenously. You can keep on playing that you represent Ironforge government and I will stick to only accepting the authority of the NPCs. Live and let live; tolerate one another. As long as you don't have to actually interact on basis of premisses you disapprove of, you don't really have a reason to complain. It's none of my business what other people I don't interact with are playing.

Except the Senate of Ironforge is something that does actually exist in lore, when the senate was created it was origonally designed in mind to create events for the community and bring people into Khaz'Modan with such things as festivals,military events,tournaments and other dwarven themed events as well as focusing on the protection of Ironforge and it's interests which is why i find it perfectly acceptable for the justice department of Ironforge to select certain individuals who may be deemed a threat to Khaz'Modan and it's people, perhaps it oversteps with certain bounties and certain rewards for the bounties but not all of the material can be slammed.

It is very possible that Rargnasha Bloodmark for example is seen as too much of a threat to let alone even with a rebellion in the midst infact you could say in such a confusion now would be the best time to have a license out upon his head perhaps at a stretch even the Red Blade tribe itself. As for the Gurubashi well a dwarven tradition is just being upheld on that part.

As for the Horde section that one is debateable but bear in mind their is two Hordes at the moment the True Horde and -The- Horde neither of them are lore-breaking if they're taken in alive tbh in a world where we have spies and espionage you think it entirely improbable the Alliance won't pull a punch under the belt and condone the populace to do so through monetary gain? I find that unlikely afterall the Alliance has it's fair share of devious men and women though i don't really see such bounties for True Horde Officers taking off any time soon though with the limited amount of Kor'Kron around if any at all.

In fairness however for such devious plots i think in the efforts of Rp creation they not be advertised in such an open manner to the general populace such a thing is more befitting the more shady parts of the Alliance who'd like to make some coin yet not be so easily traced back the opportunity is there and can be perfectly reasonable if thought out.


But as i have said not all of this can or should be slammed their are some good pieces within it that can be used to create Rp.

As for the Darkspear Rebellion being our Allies it's to be fair more of a Truce if anything rather than an Alliance something the Alliance and -The- Horde are familiar with on certain occassions especially when it benefits them both though i would not say the Darkspear Rebellion are our Allies of this moment but merely a party whom shares a mutual interest in a certain Orc's fall from his pedestal afterall Tyrande does say to Vol'Jin " We are not here for you troll! We are here for Kalimdor!" The Alliance has one interest and one interest only and that is winning their war it just so happens the Rebellion caused such an opportunity to take place nothing more. The Darkspears if anything to the Alliance are merely cannon fodder in the Alliance's war against Garrosh Hellscream.


Final Note.

As for some of the comments said here about the post well frankly they've been more blatant nay-saying than moving towards anything close to being constructive criticism of what might work well and what may need changing afterall it's only a forum post nothing is set in stone about it the post has it's good points and it has it's bad points and frankly i see nothing wrong with singling out a tribes leader as well as the Gurubashi who may both be threats to the people of Khaz'Modan that's perfectly fine in all honesty on the other parts of things such as Garrosh and The Horde/True Horde and perhaps the Red Blades may require a bit of hindsight upon them.

Plus can you honestly sit there and say it would not be fun to hunt Rargnasha or a Gurubashi? All in all it is a good idea some things perhaps need re-looked at or worked to be done in an acceptable way that is perfectly plausible and doesn't skew lore too much or at all, but their is an idea in this thread that can be utilised to good effect with a bit of communication just a shame that certain people in the community are more quick to denounce it immediatley and throw it all into the trash


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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by erwtenpeller on Mon Sep 30, 2013 6:41 am

Burgen wrote:Except the Senate of Ironforge is something that does actually exist in lore.
That only makes it worse. You're putting your character in a place of power it can't be in, because that place is already taken by figures in the lore. You are not the dwarven senate. It already exists. And you certainly don't make decisions for an entire faction in the lore.

What you can do, is put a price on their heads in name of The Three Hammers. The player-created organisation.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Amaryl on Mon Sep 30, 2013 6:55 am

I have always used the different councils for my own gain, i,e; Icly advertise events, and as a news program.

On the habit of power, I try to distance myself from that as much as possible, mostly because it smells slightly elitst, not necessarily the people running it, but the system itself. In a; I decide how this sandbox is run, and who can make the castles. Not that the actual result of the council/senate/circle has ever been absolutely that, on the contrary usually it hasn't. But perception is a powerful thing.

I recal bashing fort, gahalla, terenor etc very strongly for being part of it for so long. And I was in the same guild, and we got along very well.

My main gripe really about this "political shit" is that it has never actually had any sort of sense, because it has no power. it has no consequence. I have never had the dwarves not participate in W-PvP, regardless of their current standing with Stormwind, this might be due to Amy's relations with TTH and DRS over the years, but ultimately, oocly we want to rp-pvp, so we join together. Making the political process moot, beyond the IC telegraph function of events.

Likewise, I would actually ignore ICly any attempt that would prevent me from doing what I want OOCly in terms of events etc, simply because I can. Which makes the political system powerless. compare that to the meta-game of Eve, where you're per definition roleplaying, you better not fuck up or you lose your ship, your pod, your fleet, your money, your space-stations and you space, for simply making the wrong person angry.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Thelos on Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:17 am

Now that we're on the subject (though not really):

Why do you insist on using Stalinist imagery for your dwarven role-play?

I don't get it.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Gilran on Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:48 am



OOC:
May I remind you all this this forum is IC, thus any OOC comments are not welcome here and only contribute to the unwanted thread derailing. This post was targeted to a selected audiance, if this post does not affect you in any way, then move on. Your OOC opinions and wishes are not important here neither does the post request of you should throw them here, instead, as was suggested, create a thread to discuss this issue in an appropriate forum section.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Guest on Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:49 am

Thelos,

So the people who have little to no brain cells on DefiasRP can go crazy over it.

Can you not see how amusing it is? Smile

The fact that dwarven RP is nothing like a 'Marxist' dictatorship is even better, it's just your normal every day slightly corrupt system that has Senators promoting people based on personal loyalty and excluding the ones they dislike, nothing new to political systems in the last 2,500 years.

Amaryl,

That's something we're trying to remedy from both an OOC & IC organizational perspective and we have done so before. TTH has pulled out of RP-PvP or RP themed wPvP due to differing IC perspectives (or at least used the bluff to do so) and that's part of the theme of political RP.

As for the other posters who keep re-posting the same thing i.e you Erwt, nothing is going to change, you are free to not co-ordinate with the Senate in any shape or form, nobody is going to force you. We are taking on the role of the Dwarven Senate and contributing to the Dwarven roleplaying scenario with a way that offers an institution that is there to solve problems and provide a government themed framework. The decisions that are made by the Senate of Ironforge reflect the will of Ironforge as far as we are concerned and that's the RP we are in. Unless of course directly contradicting the voice of the Council of the Three Hammers, which we have never done so thus far.

As far as I'm aware the Council have agreed to support their ally the Kingdom of Stormwind in curb stomping Garrosh Hellscream, I don't ever remember Moira stating she's giving Rargnasha Bloodmark or the Red Blade Tribe, whom are common enemies of most of TTH and frequent combatants any sort of clemency whatsoever. Also I highly encourage you to take Drustai's post into account as well because that way I won't need to repeat her.

I will develop on the character Moira in more detail in a separate thread to clarify her attitude and behaving as I have something prepared (mostly sourcing the Council of the Three Hammers short story, which I recommend to read if you have not).

Otherwise I am requesting a lock on this sadly derailed thread.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Thelos on Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:27 am

Cerik Ironforge wrote:Thelos,

So the people who have little to no brain cells on DefiasRP can go crazy over it.

Can you not see how amusing it is? Smile

So, basicly, you're calling me stupid?

Well, okay. We're done here.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Bradley on Mon Sep 30, 2013 9:23 am

Let them RP it out, and don't make a big deal out of this. It's a fun concept anyway, and it's potential RP for quite a few people.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Guest on Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:40 pm

Now that the derailing is over, the IC aspect can continue. All licenses continue, prod or post if interested.


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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Skarain on Tue Oct 01, 2013 5:43 am

A figure in gray robes pass by one such notice by the night-hours of Ironforge. Pulling out a wooden wand, Skarain moves the tip closer to the notice, a faint light glowing in the tip, reading the notice in the light of magical light. She smiles faintly as she reads further.

"I wonder, how would they mind an exile of the Alliance hunting their criminals? Criminals hunting criminals... " She snorts amused to the thought. "I think i will remain in the shadows for now. Light be merciful for any who takes on those tasks, for those listed sure are not if the hunters themselves get caught". Skarain lowers her wand, tucking it back within her robes. When the next guard patrols soon through the passage, no signs of the woman in gray robes remain.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Guest on Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:25 am

Due to on-going negotiations, all Foreign based licenses are temporarily suspended.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

Post by Diederich on Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:57 pm

Pretty good idea, could spur some nice RP.

But the Stalin images kind of make this lolrp.

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Re: [Notices are put throughout the Kingdom of Khaz Modan]

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