[IC] Why is the Light divine?

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[IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Voice of the People on Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:02 pm

*Familiar posters are put up all around the city, not just one place this time*

My Lords, ladies, gentlemen, common-folk, foreigners, guttersnipes and their holiness,

I have listened carefully to the reaction to these campaigns against that sweet building, the church. I hear, that we have no reasons.. I have no injustices to present, nor any wackadoodle theories. Simply logic.

The Church holds the ideal that the light is a sentient force that blesses us with its sweet, golden goodness.. However. Is it divine? Is it sentient? Or is it just magic? No one worships the arcane, fools worship the shadow and the night elves revere nature. The Blood Elves wielded the light, when they took a creature composed of it prisinor, however when it was taken back, they retained the ability to use the light.. This was claimed to be proof the Light blesses who it sees fit to wield it. However back in the days of old the Blood Elves taught the Arathorian Humans to cast the arcane. No one claimed the Arcane blessed them. It was taught. Like a trade. This is how the light is friends, if we tear down the cathedral and build houses for our poor, the light will not stop being used by our 'priests' or 'paladins'. They use it through practise and control. I thought explanation was due here, I will show no mercy to those who cling to telling the poor that the light will save them, while they squander wealth on rituals and attire for their church.

Your humble and obedient servant,
Long live the Grand Alliance,
The Voice of the People.

P.s My dear Chaplain Jean-Pierre, while I would enjoy to meet with you and discuss philosophy, I couldn't trust your fanatical cousin-order to stay their blades.. And I may not have become the voice of -your- people, but I speak for the people who are suppressed, and have no rights to a voice.



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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Samian/Bismack on Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:50 pm

Dear voice, and its people. I sense you have a great need of wanting to express yourself, should you be looking for ears perhaps my command center some time soon?

Crudely inked over a set of posters along with drawings of "cats" (they dont really look like cats)

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Aldric Essalus Helmfrid on Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:59 pm

*Rough yet simple lettering painted hastily over a small few of the posters placed in more key locations within the city.*

"The Light is distant, but it is also close, the Light penetrates the whole universe and yet whispers to the heart of every man, compelling him to do Good and shun Evil; to ignore this call of Good, is to choose a path of wickedness."

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Lorainne/Bridlington on Wed Apr 11, 2012 1:15 am

*Elegant writing that may be recognised by some.*

"Dear Voice,

However biased your writings may be, I somehow find truth in what you write, and am intrigued by your critisism towards the Church, the State and the King.
Should you ever wish to discuss this topic in person, please write to the Explorer's Hall in Ironforge. Address the letter to Ms. Young.

Kind regards,
Abigale Young."

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Jeanpierre on Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:21 am

Another letter is stuck by the Gilded Rose.

"To the Voice of the People.

I am flattered that you would address me so publicly. I believe it also points out we understand one another in this: my words are public and I will stand by my actions, with whom I talk and when. I will not hide, not from the people, not from my Lord, not from my duties to both.

You express concern about your safety in public, with me. If you fear the public without me, cloaked in your anonimity, then surely you must appear as but another person seeking to converse with me?
Never the less, I mourn that you must take such measures to feel safe, when we fight so hard to make people feel safe from repression. Perhaps, you see our battle in this, as oppression as well?
Alas, I see it as a great loss that we can not speak comfortably. How can I aid to remedy that? Meanwhile, I shall speak with written word.

You speak of the nature of Light. Are you taught and educated in the matter, that you have such a strong voice in it?
I confess, I am taught that the Light is a sentient force in every living being. I have no material proof for that. I have my faith, and I truly believe it to be true, because I feel its call and strength flow through me. It is in my soul and heart that I find the fuel to call upon the Light. I have not the slightest idea on how to prove that, without asking people to listen to what their hearts tells them. Would you accept such as proof?
By my knowledge, however, no Mage ever claimed the Light to be deduced from the Arcane.

You are right that our methods in the light will not cease to be, should we loose our beloved Cathedral. But do you truly believe tearing down our Cathedral will aid the poor? How many houses can be built from its stones? More than we already aid every day? Will you tear down the infirmary which, when all other help failed, nurtured so many people back to health, rich or poor? Do you expect taking the Cathedral's stones will yield building blocks faster than gathering new ones?

The Cathedral was built upon a time that permitted such a building, and not at the expense of others. It was built to provide a house of healing and renewing one's physical and emotional strength in difficult times. For one house, I believe it has housed a great many more than any other building ever has. Certainly more than individual houses made by its mere bricks.

It tries to be a house for all.. Ahh yes, there we have reached a difficulty: all who do not seek to harm others. Even you, would be welcomed in spite of our apparent theological conflict. We have a priest to greet all who come. Have you ever seen him not greet a person, lest you were so many he could not muster the breath for it? Has he ever refused a person? I doubt he has ever intervened.

You envy our richess, but I wonder which. Most of the clerics have a vow of austerity and live only on what they need. Our altar is but simple wood, decorated with a cloth as old as the city itself. Is it our chandeliers that rouse your anger then?

Never the less... we must have failed our people if they truly feel we waste valuable resources on robes when we should have helped them live through these difficult times. You speak of housing for the poor... I claim our Cathedral is exactly that.
If such has not been clear before, perhaps we can send notice that all people are welcome to stay in the Cathedral overnight, until these times have passed. Would such a measure help your goals?
It might ours. I will propose the idea at the Council... though I believe our Brothers and Sisters in the Cathedral will already do what they can in the meantime.

May we speak again.
Jean-Pierre d'Armagnac."

((And sorry about the OOC joke on the "will even greet a shadow cultist just as long as his class is 'priest'"- fella in the Cathedral. I couldn't resist Very Happy ))

_____________________________________________________
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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Melnerag on Wed Apr 11, 2012 4:18 am

This essay has been published with some grudging reluctance, and in vain hope that it will reach The Voice. Publishes made it known that they will not publish anything again if this gets censored or evoces the public wrath


Dear ‘Voice of the People’,

Let me begin with expressing my sympathy and regret. I find it intolerable those who express their views about the Light in Stormwind have reason to fear for their lives and need to hide as you do. I would desire nothing more than to meet you in person, in a public room where everybody can come and listen while we may speak without fear. The Light belongs to all and none, it is shameful that some monopolize it and cut down those who do not read the same books. I am grateful that the Law itself remains congruent with Justice and no magistrate would ever find you guilty of any crimes for expressing your views, but sadly there is more than magistrates on the streets of Stormwind.

You question the ‘divinity’ of the Light.

What does it mean for something to be ‘divine’? Does it mean to be worthy of worship, possessed of sentience and great power, capable of answering prayers and sending miracles, all of these or none? You never specified.
Let us explore the ‘sentience’ first. The Light is not sentient. Poetic language of the holy texts may anthropomorphize the Light and ascribe to it features that make it seem sentient, but as far as I am aware no theologian (except the Chapter of Uther that existed briefly in Stormwind) ever claimed the Light to actually have sentience. Yes, the Light is just like the Arcane in this respect – it is a power devoid of sentience and consciousness.

Does the Light have miraculous power? Yes, it does. I think nobody would ever deny that power called ‘the Light’ is capable of great feats which seem miraculous and make most arcane spells seem weak and inadequate. Yet these miracles are also not reliable; most priests will fail to bring back the dead with their prayers, but sometimes…just sometimes they may suddenly raise whole squads to life. Mostly, grievous wounds are beyond their reach….but sometimes they can restore the body perfectly with a single passionate prayer.

Does the Light answer prayers? That would depend on your definition of ‘answering a prayer’. I assure you that I’ve never seen, read of or heard of a holy apparition descend towards a Faithful and take out his laundry, walk his dog or win his battles. Discussing the answering of prayers is a meaningless task, because there is no method to differentiate between a chance-based satisfaction of a request and divine intervention (unless it is a priest or a paladin wreathed in holy glow, but then one can argue that to be their magical skill, not an answer to prayers).

Is the Light just like the Arcane? It is not. Mages of the Kirin Tor will eagerly tell you that one does not draw on the power of the Arcane and power of the Light (or Elune or the Spirits) in the same way. Here lies the fundamental distinction between ‘Arcane’ Magic and ‘Divine’ Magic. In purely technical terms of spellcraft the Light is nothing like the Arcane, it is ‘divine’ in a sense that skill and knowledge alone are not sufficient to cast Holy spells. You require something called ‘faith’.

So, what is this thing called ‘faith’? A stroll through an asylum easily shows that ‘belief’ is not enough to start smiting and casting holy fire. Faith is something more. Faith is unquestionable trust in the Light and congruence between the Self and the ideals embodied by the Light. Do not ask me to explain in detail how the Scarlet Crusaders or the Chapter can call on the Light when they spur so many of its ideals, perhaps their belief in those few ideals they still follow is powerful indeed.

One can of course argue that this is no difference between the Arcane and the Light. Those who wield the Arcane are called upon by the Arcane to wield more, master new spells and draw upon more power. Those who wield the Light are called upon by the Light to follow further the ideals the Light represents. One can argue that the Arcane is also ‘divine’, after all the mage who wields it embodies its ‘ideals’ – Arcane ‘desires’ only to be used, and used some more; the mage also has trust that his formulae and spells will work and yield a result. That, however, is not the case. Priests and paladins can ‘fall from grace’, lose their faith and be unable to call upon the Light. A mage who loses trust in his abilities but performs the spell correctly will not experience any such troubles.

This is the main difference between the Light and the Arcane – the Light requires a degree of unity with the ideals represented by the Light and trust (faith) in the Light itself. A paragon of virtue who has no trust in the Light cannot wield it.

But all that is just talk. The important question , of course, is this: “Is the Light worthy of devotion?”

A better question yet is, “What is the requirement to be worthy of devotion?”

The Light is certainly a source of comfort and inspiration. Those who trust in the Light have found their refuge and fear neither storms nor enemies, they have found a purpose in life and are not beset by anxiety. They feel a sense of belonging and peace. The Light also inspires to act upon the ideals it represents and helps people follow these ideals more closely. If you want to be a good, just and compassionate person then following the Light is a logical, reasonable next step. I do not imply that one cannot be Good without the Light, merely that it is easier to be Good with Light’s aid and one can go further on the path of Good-ness with the Light rather than without It.

The Light is certainly worthy of ‘devotion’ in this strict sense of putting your trust in it, having Faith in its ideals and seeking to follow them and gaining unity with it. The Light is worth having as the overwhelming presence in your heart, devoting your being to It.

Does devotion imply ‘worship’? What can an inspired and overwhelmed person do but to express his love and gratitude? It is easy with another being, but how does one express what he feels towards the Light? I would not say that ‘worship’ is either mandatory or deplorable, I see no reason why it should be forced on anybody or condemned. Let those who wish to express their love for the Light do so with their prayers and rituals, odes and praises, icons and monuments. The thing is, the Cathedral and other material representations of Faith have been built from the money freely given by the faithful in their desire to express their adoration of the Light. If they find it a worthwhile expenditure, who are we to condemn then?

Does ‘worship’ naturally lead to Organized Religion? I see no reason why those who adore the Light and seek to follow it cannot band together and share the intense experience. In any such group, naturally, there would arise those who are more skilled and eloquent and have more time and energy to put into it than others. Those will be seen as figureheads, teachers and perhaps leaders. Perhaps in time the leaders might forget their origins and become rulers, trying to forcefully spread upon others that which justifies their power – faith in a social edifice of customs, modes of behavior, symbols and material possessions created by the organized community.

Organized Religion of the Light is not the Light itself. One may very well say that romance novels are love and warstories are courage and heroism. Religion is fallible and flawed, it is a culture created by their faithful in their attempt to express their intense feelings for the Light and communicate them to others. It is an amalgam of habits and behaviors that became accepted and in time canonized. Failings of this or that Church say nothing about the Light, just like a poorly-written romance does not invalidate Love.
I know enough of dealing with the public to know that long theological essays make for poor poster-material, but I implore you to explain in what way exactly the Light is not ‘divine’, because by all common definition it does appear to be a Divine Power. Although perhaps you should simply try and prove that it is not worthy of Devotion.

Keep up your struggle, but do not distort the facts. Perhaps one day we will both be able to discuss this in the light of day.

-Helen of Elwynn



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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Jeanpierre on Wed Apr 11, 2012 4:46 am

((And there I thought I was being a bother my long winded post... hehehe. I already pity the voice of the people Very Happy ))

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Melnerag on Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:01 am

((I hope he who claims to be the Voice of the people is also ready to be their ear! It is after all a fool who speaks but never listens))

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Demurral on Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:16 am

To the one who claims to speak for the People.
Your words ring true, but you lack all the arguments needed to fight your cause.
The Light is nothing more than a tool wielded by man, and like all tools, can be used for both good and ill. Tools do not have sentience. Tools do not have good or bad intentions towards humanity. They simply exist to do a job.
A hammer may be used to craft a shield to protect others, or it may be used to craft a sword to remove life from others. Yet either action does not make the hammer good, nor evil. It is the guiding hand of the hammer, the person wielding the tool, that decides.
The Light is nothing more than a tool. It can be used to burn or sooth, to harm or heal. But it is neither good, nor evil.

A seeker of truth, not smoke and lies,
Abigale Grey.

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Magnir on Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:45 am

"Why is the Light divine?"

Because the Draenei's say it is, and they never lie!

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Eowale on Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:35 am

(( Must.. not.. spread.. Shadow.. propaganda! ))

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Amatho on Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:56 am

Amatho stood before the poster – having the words echo in her mind for a few moments.

“The voice of the people,”she whispered.

She shifted her awareness towards her ears, she closed her eyes, listening to the city of Stormwind bustling with activity. The bells of the cathedral rang loudly with a constant 'ding-ding-ding' and a few people made their way to a mass in honor of the light.

Amatho observed the happiness and relief coming from people heading towards the Cathedral. The short state the people found themselves in during their brief relief of the business of the day, seemed above sacred to Amatho, and she turned her attention back towards the poster.

“I think the Voice Of The People also needs a new set of ears, eyes and perhaps some insight.” she whispered.

She turned around, and followed the people to the Cathedral, attending the mass.

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Granwat on Sat Apr 14, 2012 7:46 am

Granwat touched the poster. He rubbed his hand assessing the material.

“Parchment.. Of skin?”

He slowly touched the poster from top to bottom, trying to find anything that would state otherwise. He reached forward to take a smell.

“Certainly doesn't smell like skin.”

He reached towards the left lower corner, and tore a small piece from it. He held it up in the light and looked at it as if he was holding a gem into a ray of sunlight.

“Paper, tipa – nicely made. Stormwind paper at it's finest.”

Without any regard for the information, he continued along the way, into the market district.

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Ishap/Virock on Sat Apr 14, 2012 9:38 am

*Reads the notice JP has put up* He's going to meet this guy without any back-up and get kid-napped again isn't he? *sighs and walks off*

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Geldar on Sat Apr 14, 2012 8:33 pm

"Dear writer, why is the Light considered divine? I suggest asking your question to Tirion Fodring and asking him what happened in Icecrown."

_____________________________________________________

Creating situations of a dramatic nature since season 3.

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Xen-tau on Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:16 am

((Aishling is a magister and can understand the common tongue and writing. We'll just assume she got it in Dalaran from some bloke please, and that she writes back anonymously))

As Aishling reads the paper, she couldn't help but smirk a bit.
"By belore, this is actually quite fun to read. Most of it is human politics, but I see the choices made by us are... questioned. Let me be polite and return the favour why they have become to be the weak and pathetic race with us in comparison."

Dear writer,

I like to begin with the fact that I read this article in the human capital of magic, Dalaran. Here they have knowledge of quite a bit of magic. They do not hold the as much knowledge on the Light as they do in Silvermoon, but I call myself a Quel'dorei, so I cannot browse that glorious library, but I can inform you on what I can find here.

The Light is like every form of nature. You only need to be attuned with it to cast it. Do not believe that only those "divine enough" are able to access that pool. Before the siege of Quel'danas and the recapture of the Sunwell, the brave Blood Knights captured a Naaru that allowed those that needed the Light to use it, and even today that Light is provided for every Sin'dorei, or Blood Elf, through the Sunwell, which proves that even the most common people are able to grasp its power.

It is even a bigger lie that the Light can only be provided to those that are 'Good'. It is used to oppress those that form a danger of society, as the Light can also be used by "Paladins" to kill. And you humans are most confident with the Light and strong believers of it being good, but yet your own Arch-Bishop, the person that should embody the Light, could not resist to corruption.

Your question, I cannot answer. I am an arcanist, and I do not like to use two sources of power. But I hope I can show you that it is not devine, and that a Cathedral is 'just another building'. It has nothing to do with the Light, it is 'just a building, consisting of stone and glass'. Heck, I do think that those most devine do not need a building to preach, they can use a box.

I hope I have informed you enough, and I did not express my own feelings too much except for that last part.

Yours,

Ilingsha.
Quel'dorei Mage.


Aishling grins, as she made her own name into an anagram, yet keeping the Sin'dorei naming. She went to the postoffice of Dalaran, and as nobody was watching the posted the letter. Ofcourse, with a seal with a two wing marking. Without a colour around it, it was the same for both the Quel'dorei as the Sin'dorei, so it did not really make a difference.

((I had so much fun trying to think of 'false propaganda' and ways to keep Stormwind busy, that I had to write this when I felt inspired. If it feels too.. lorelol that a Blood Elf got her hands on this, just ignore it then)).

_____________________________________________________
Horde:
Sin'dorei Aishling Silversun - Crimson Imperium - Working in Silvermoon
Pandaren Houjin Monk: Mao-Teng Swiftstrike - Traveling.
Alliance:
Human(Worgen) Death Knight Aeron Turner - Killing, somewhere.
(A)Pandaren Tushui Monk: Xen-Tau Swiftstrike - Finding a place to live


Idea borrowed from: Nilda Meyrick and Monrena

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

Post by Samian/Bismack on Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:59 am

"Right that is quite enough.."

As of then most of Stormwind's guards are seen with a bucket of water and a brush instead of a shield. All boards/walls are getting swiped clean of any message or poster.

(( The regiment is also selling shirts:
Spoiler:
))

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Re: [IC] Why is the Light divine?

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