Magic Guide WIP

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Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:59 am

This is primarily for the teachers, to help them with instruction. Already-learned mages also benefit.

As this guide is only a WIP, I'm only posting it here. I intend on posting it in Game Discussion later once it's finished.


Sections in DARK RED are either incomplete or need to be rewritten for clarification and better understanding.


...

ARTICLE WAS FINISHED. COMPLETE WORK CAN BE FOUND HERE.


Last edited by Drustai on Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:56 am; edited 7 times in total

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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:59 am

.


Last edited by Drustai on Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:56 am; edited 15 times in total

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[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
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"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:59 am

.


Last edited by Drustai on Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:56 am; edited 10 times in total
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:00 am

... whew. There.

Who knew this forum had a word count? I could fit my whole DK guide on just one post. <.<


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[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
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"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by erwtenpeller on Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:47 am

How. Lee. Shit.

...I'm going to have to read this in bits. Take some time. Hmyes.
I feel this would also benefit from some charts, lists and illustrations to break up the big blocks of text.
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:11 am

Yeah, I want to have some pictures and such.

I do have one picture already, though I'm thinking about redoing it to make it more clear before putting it in the guide.

Spoiler:

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[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
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"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Lexgrad on Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:20 am

Now it is in picture form you have totally cleared things up Dru Very Happy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by erwtenpeller on Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:44 am

It's a bit weird that "shadow" get's it's own type, but "light" does not?

I would say the overall model is pretty complete, but at the same time may be too complex, combining ideas that where not intended to be combined; though you have mentioned this.

Delidahs theories vary a little from this, though. She uses tailoring analogies to reflect spellweaving in a model that's based on two simple rules:

> Mana is the energy it takes to pull threads from a source.
> Threads are woven into a pattern to create a desired magical effect.

These rules are used by different casters in vastly different ways. Let's take a simple fireball spell as an example.

> A mage will pull threads from arcane energy and weave those into a learned pattern that creates a fireball.
> A shaman will pull threads from arcane energy and ask the elemental spirits to create a weave for them and deliver a completed pattern that creates a fireball.

The Devine caster asks their deity of choice to weave their magic for them, allowing the devine caster to cast weaves far beyond mortal comprehention. This is why the manifestations of devine casters magic seem so much more specific and often powerfull then a true caster. A true caster has to learn and master these weaves themselves.

This however also means that a true caster has the freedom to create whatever the fuck they want to create and devine casters are stuck with what their deities are willing to create for them.

I have never written this down in detail, so if the way i explain it here is a bit wonky, excuse me.
I have always played delidah with this theory in the back of my mind. This is why her spells are so weird, because I allow her to create them however she pleases, and this is why she looks down a little on devine casters. Lazy dicks don't even master their own weaves. Assholes.

--

Something different:
I once intended for delidah to go on this great quest where she would study all types of magic and casting in search of a great unified magical theory. Perhaps it would be nice to create an actual storyline out of all of this, so Dru gets a chance to write this giant compendium in character?
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Sat Mar 17, 2012 5:36 am

Delidah wrote:It's a bit weird that "shadow" get's it's own type, but "light" does not?

Light is its own type (or, more general, Holy). Shadow is simply an elemental force. Light/Holy is divine. Light/Holy is separate and above of everything else. It is a 'foreign' entity, just like fel. It is not an elemental (natural) force.

If I had to divide it all into categories, I'd probably do something like this now (rather than my above picture):

Light/Holy (divine)
|
Fel (foreign corruption)
|
Arcane (Fire, Earth, Air, Water), Life (the components of existence)
|
Mana (fundamental building block)
|
Shadow (void, nothingness)

Delidahs theories vary a little from this, though. She uses tailoring analogies to reflect spellweaving in a model that's based on two simple rules:

> Mana is the energy it takes to pull threads from a source.
> Threads are woven into a pattern to create a desired magical effect.

These rules are used by different casters in vastly different ways. Let's take a simple fireball spell as an example.

> A mage will pull threads from arcane energy and weave those into a learned pattern that creates a fireball.
> A shaman will pull threads from arcane energy and ask the elemental spirits to create a weave for them and deliver a completed pattern that creates a fireball.

The Devine caster asks their deity of choice to weave their magic for them, allowing the devine caster to cast weaves far beyond mortal comprehention. This is why the manifestations of devine casters magic seem so much more specific and often powerfull then a true caster. A true caster has to learn and master these weaves themselves.

This however also means that a true caster has the freedom to create whatever the fuck they want to create and devine casters are stuck with what their deities are willing to create for them.

I wouldn't say that varies at all. In fact, I've used similar metaphors myself, both tapestry and painting. It's accurate and one of the best ways to describe the act of magic, IMO. All magical effects are based on patterns. As a mage you are deliberately altering the cosmic pattern... weaving a new tapestry or painting a new picture. In Dru's own tapestry metaphors, she'd call the individual strands 'mana', the actual -color- of those strands the element, and the combination of strands to form shapes and pictures as a part of the cosmic configuration. The whole tapestry would be the complete cosmic configuration that defines the spell, object, person, etc. The workspace would be shadow (until you weave a tapestry, there is nothing but 'void' there, empty space), dirt and stains would be fel (dirtying the tapestry, 'corrupting' it), the needle would be life (creation), and the hand holding the needle would be the mage, directly weaving the spell. The -desire- to create and do good would of course be Light... separate from everything else, as it is divine.

The thread spool would probably represent the caster's own soul, since you drain yourself to cast a spell. The bigger and more complex the tapestry, the more thread is needed.

Spoiler:

Something different:
I once intended for delidah to go on this great quest where she would study all types of magic and casting in search of a great unified magical theory. Perhaps it would be nice to create an actual storyline out of all of this, so Dru gets a chance to write this giant compendium in character?

I actually considered writing this IC, (and in fact, the very first form was originally just an IC response to an IC thread Kristeas made about a year back), I ultimately went with OOC because it was easier, with the intention of writing a full IC necromancy book later on.

If you'd want a storyline for it, then that would involve learning under Dru, as she knows and teaches all of this. Though I don't think Dru would be teaching Deli at all... they might be on good terms now but Dru doesn't trust her with magic still. That being said, Dru is prone to going on long tangents if engaged in magical discussion, so if Delidah gets Dru into a discussion Deli can take notes. Smile


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[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Shaelyssa on Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:46 pm

Just saw this ... you should post this outside this subforum so everyone can see it. Well done Dru, haven't finished reading through it all yet but so glad you actually did end up writing the magic guide thing :p
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by John Helsythe Amaltheria on Mon May 28, 2012 12:16 pm

Hey.

I decided to stuff some time into reading your guide. Man, such a large guide did scare me off from reading it at first, as I am sure it did to some others. But I truly recommend people to dare and start reading this guide, as it is amazing.

Now, I am half way reading it and will continue it another day, as I am about to turn off my PC. But I noticed that some parts aren't finished yet, or you wish to adjust some parts. Are you still working on this? I sure hope so.

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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Mon May 28, 2012 12:23 pm

I want to finish it, yes. I'm just lazy. Razz


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[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by John Helsythe Amaltheria on Mon May 28, 2012 4:15 pm

I'm glad to hear, looking forward for more in that case, assuming your laziness will vanish one day. ^^

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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by erwtenpeller on Mon May 28, 2012 4:48 pm

Publish the damn guide, deadsie.
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Skarain on Tue May 29, 2012 7:48 am

Yush! The guide is awesome, even in its unfinished state. I remember when i read it the first time. I was like a child during christmas, a man in heaven....and Damn, now i feel like reading trough it again Very Happy

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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Kristeas Sunbinder on Tue May 29, 2012 8:11 am

Imagine if Einstein’s theory of relativity was broken—oh wait, that’s just happened.

Is that about the neutrino's and where they found out about the bugged detector?
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Thu May 31, 2012 4:34 am

Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:
Imagine if Einstein’s theory of relativity was broken—oh wait, that’s just happened.

Is that about the neutrino's and where they found out about the bugged detector?

Yes it was. I wrote that section before they proved it to be just a mechanical error. I should probably rewrite it.


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[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Kristeas Sunbinder on Thu May 31, 2012 5:45 am

Drustai wrote:
Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:
Imagine if Einstein’s theory of relativity was broken—oh wait, that’s just happened.

Is that about the neutrino's and where they found out about the bugged detector?

Yes it was. I wrote that section before they proved it to be just a mechanical error. I should probably rewrite it.


I'm not sure I agree with parts of that bit. But I have to read it a bit more. Like skipping the part where you make a note that it's something to explain the ooc problem with the scientific study of magic. That there just aren't any actual rules for it.
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Thu May 31, 2012 11:55 am

Yeah, I'm not really all that happy with that section in general, it's one I'm quite likely to cut from the final version.


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[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Kristeas Sunbinder on Thu May 31, 2012 12:32 pm

I'll write it out loud, the problem with magical experiment rp is that the succes or failure, aswell as the reproduction is up to the player. It only really fits if the research is the rp and the result doesn't matter.
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Thu May 31, 2012 12:37 pm

Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:I'll write it out loud, the problem with magical experiment rp is that the succes or failure, aswell as the reproduction is up to the player. It only really fits if the research is the rp and the result doesn't matter.

That's the case with all RP.


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[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Drustai on Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:54 am

The schools of magic have been completed. Evocation, Transmutation, and Enchantment have all been added/brought up-to-date.

I will revise the elements section and write the conclusion and then finally post this in the Gameplay forum. The reagents section I'll likely wait on because this will never get finished otherwise.


_____________________________________________________
[I] Drustai the Necromancer - Outcast
[A] RADM Areyah Conover - Missing in Action
[L] Saphra Emberstone - Felsworn
[H] Atsenkha - Former Kor'kron, Red Blade Tribesorc


"...in any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself... In all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions."

—The Iron Law of Bureaucracy
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Lexgrad on Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:07 am

What does WIP mean btw?
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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Skarain on Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:36 am

Work. In. Progress

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Re: Magic Guide WIP

Post by Lexgrad on Sat Jul 21, 2012 8:39 am

Ah! kk.
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